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[HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

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[HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Fromundaman on Tue Aug 11, 2009 11:36 am

So, I really want a Flayed One hero, and took it upon myself to attempt to make one, the problem being, I suck at doing more than providing a very rough concept:


GrassEdit((
Story:
Twisted and ghoulish terrors of the night, the Flayed Ones advance before the Necron force, spreading fear like a plague before them. Stopped yet terrifyingly agile beasts from man's darkest nightmares, the Flayed Ones' long flensing blades can strip the skin from their prey in seconds. Thin and wiry, they adorn themselves with the still-wet hides of their victimes, leaving the skinned corpses to sow fear and confusion amongst their enemies' ranks.

stats:
strength: 20 + 2.5
->agility: 24 + 1.5
inteligence: 17 + 1.3

range: melee
movespeed: 295

(innate) Flay:
Flayed ones drape themselves in the skins of their foes, sowing fear, and causing their enemies to pause, even for a moment, before taking fire on possible allies. The Flayed One takes the skin of whomever it kills, each skin increasing the effects of its Terrifying Visage skill by .25/.5/.75/1/1.25/1.5%, as well as giving the Flayed one 3/3.5/4/4.5/5/5.5% damage reduction. Max of 5/9/13/17/21/25 skins, and a skin will be destroyed for every 100 damage blocked.

(strike from beneath?)
Flayed Ones usually enter a battle by being teeleported underground, the surficing beneath their enemies, slashing their legs out from underneath them. The Flayed One burrows underground, and tunnels towards the target unit. Upon reaching the target, it emerges in a spray of dirt, slashing at nearby enemies, dealing 50/100/150/200 damage, and slowing by 35% for 4 seconds. The target takes an additional 50/80/110/140 damage.
cd: ~20, manacost: 120/125/130/135, range: 800-1200 ish
mechanics: travels at the speed of 60 units per .1 seconds (600 ms)

(name... flaying claws?)
The Flayed One stabs its victim with its sharp clawed hands, dealing 50/100/150/200 damage and hurling it backwards for 300/400/500/600 range, every unit that it hits, will damage both the tossed unit, and the target for 50/60/70/80 damage. Units hit by the target and knocked away slightly.
cd: 14, manacost: 90/100/110/120

Terrifying Visage
Flayed Ones wear the skins of their fallen enemies, sowing fear and confusion in their ranks. Every second, units near the flayed one will have a 2/4/6/8% chance to succumb to the Flayed One's terrifying presence, and run 100 units away from the Flayed One, or untill it is at least 150 distance away from it.
aoe: 400

Ult: Disruption fields
The bladed hands of the Flayed Ones are able to warp the space around them, causing them to phase through armor, and warp the flesh underneath. While active, the Flayed One ignores 60/80/100% of his enemies armor. lasts 10/15/20 seconds.
cd: 100, manacost: 160/200/240

there u go, finished up your hero for you, added stats, descriptions, finished skills. feel free to change any of this, as it is your hero. ))

//original suggestion:
Spoiler:
Flayed Ones: (I'll let you make the unit description Grass, since yours are better than mine can ever hope to be, and I can't reinstall my version of DoW for inspiration since I lost the game manual.)
He would be a tanker hero. Ganker does make more sense.
I would propose basic stats and stat growths, but I'm really bad with that sort of thing, so I'm just going to lay down a very basic concept.


Innate: He should really either share the same innate as Necron Lord, take Necron Lord's innate (Since Necron Lord is one of the few who actually DOESN'T reassemble on death), or take an innate based on his ability to teleport across the map/crawl out from beneath your feet when in a monolith.

Innate: Flay
[Description] The Flayed Ones drape themselves in the skins of the fallen. When an enemy unit dies, the Flayed One can harvest the skin, increasing his already gruesome appearance to make them appear even more terrifying. (Or something like that, but put a little more eloquently.)
[Effect] The Flayed One harvests the skins of fallen foes. Each skin gives (1/1.5/2/2.5/3/3.5%)? damage reduction, and increases the effect of his Terrifying Visage skill by x% per skin, for a max of 6/9/12/15/18/21 skins. Each skin absorbs 50/60/70/80/90/100 damage before wearing out. (Max amount of skins increases per level. I'm thinking 0.2-0.4 per skin, with a max of maybe 6 skins at first, and up to around 15-20 at max level? Maybe add something that uses the skins too, or a duration before they rot, to encourage getting new ones?)
just threw some numbers in there. dont know how balanced that will be

Skill 1: Currently unnamed. (strike from beneath? they came from below? some suggestions for a name)
[description] FLayed ones usualy enter battle by being teleported underground, where they emerge slashing at their enemies legs, adding to their terrifying appearance.
[effect] The Flayed one burrows underground, and emerges underneath the target (point/unit) crippling (all/the target) units, slowing by 30% and dealing 80/160/240/320 damage. Flayed Ones crawl out of the ground in a target AoE and slash at the enemy's legs, wounding and crippling them. Slows and damages.
Alternatively, you could make it a sort of damaging blink attack where instead of it being an AoE thing where he calls up other Flayed Ones, the hero could simply teleport and crawl up out of the ground to cripple the enemy unit's legs instead.

cosmetic: the flayed one plays its attack animation, and if possible, i make it sink into the ground... then to show the flayed one burrowing, mini earthquake animations appear in a line, moving towards the target unit, upon reaching the target, the impale target dust is played on the target and the flayed one, and everyone around him is slowed and damaged (maby the target getting more, and the side units less, dunno) *this means its not an instant, but moves at about 50-100 units per... .2/.3 seconds, and follows the target*


Skill 2: Terrifying Visage:
[description] Flayed Ones wear the skin of their victims to battle to intimidate and horrify their foes. When faced by this metallic monstrosity wearing the skin of their comrades, even the hardiest of warriors will flee for their lives.
[effect] Passive or toggle aura that gives the enemy a chance to break whatever their previous actions and run away from the Flayed One (only about say 50-200 distance away, since you wouldn't want to have to chase your victims across the map.). I was thinking of a 1/2/3/4/5% chance of causing enemy to flee per second.

Skill 3: Currently unnamed.
[description]
[effect] Based on his finishing move in DoW, the Flayed One would either 1 hit KO a creep, then hurl him at a target AoE, or he could have a passive chance after killing a unit to throw the unit at a target area (make it so that if the move does happen, you can then choose where to throw him. If that's not doable, then just throw it in an AoE in front of him.), dealing damage grab a unit in it's metallic claws and hurl it at a target area. All foes in the area it lands in take W/X/Y/Z damage, and the thrown unit takes A/B/C/D damage per unit in the AoE.

Ultimate: Disruption Field
[Effect]
For a short time (15-45 seconds?), the Flayed One's attack is able to warp the skin/armor of his opponent, resulting in a portion of his damage ignoring armor completely (50/75/100%?).

edited your post a little, and i think i might be able to do pure damage attacks, so u can add that in


Last edited by Fromundaman on Mon Aug 17, 2009 8:54 pm; edited 8 times in total
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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Grass Hopper on Tue Aug 11, 2009 1:36 pm

people dont read Sad
(moved to suggestions btw:P)
edit: nvm my bad... i just realsed it doesnt say dont post in the heroes forum XD


Last edited by Grass Hopper on Tue Aug 11, 2009 1:48 pm; edited 2 times in total

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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Grass Hopper on Tue Aug 11, 2009 1:46 pm

however! about the hero:

my thoughts would be that a flayed on would be a ganker style hero really...

im thinking lowerer str than the lord, but higher agi, and still a *very* low int with around average ms (295-305)

yes necron lords do have wbb, but i dont know about giving the flayed on the same innate... i would almost want to, but... its not good practice to give identical skills to two diff heroes.

for skill one, i would make it so the flayed one burrows into the ground and attacks ether an enemy on the other end, or an aoe. (if you make mroe flayed ones come, it detracts from the 'hero' feel of the flayed one)

skill two i like, but why is it toggleable? and i might change the name to terrifying visage, cause thats what its called in TT.

also, i dont remeber much of DoW, so i dont remeber that sync kill XD

some other ideas, in TT hes got infiltrate, deep strike, and move through cover. as well as wbb and gruesome attire Razz

other things to think of. well.. flay? Razz have him 'collect skins' when he kills stuff. to what effect i dont know

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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Fromundaman on Tue Aug 11, 2009 2:02 pm

Hmmm... yeah, it was a very basic concept.

Didn't know where to put this, so I just put it there.

While I agree with you, Flayed Ones moved so slowly in DoW, it feels almost wrong to make him agi based. That being said, this is indeed based on the TT vers, so yeah.


-Skill 1: yeah, I think him burrowing and attacking an enemy on the other end would be the better bet actually.

-Skill 2 (Terrifying Visage makes a better name, so let's keep that): I have a lot of trouble thinking of how balanced this would or wouldn't be, so I mentioned passive or toggle, because I wasn't sure if it would be too good for it to be free or not.

-skill 3: No worries, scratch that then. I don't know his TT skills, so I threw that up instead. I just remembered how awesome it looked and thought it could be worked into a skill somehow.


Flay could maybe be either innate or ultimate?
Make him able to collect skins from the fallen (Use Cannibalize) to boost stats, or temp boost Terrifying Visage's effectiveness?


Deep Strike, while important to Flayed Ones, would take away from the boots. Infiltrate is the cloak thing, right? What is move through cover though?
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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Grass Hopper on Tue Aug 11, 2009 2:04 pm

deepstrike is essetially flayed ones burrowing up from underneath their foes, infiltrate allows them to deploy further ahead in a battle, and move through cover allows them to move better through difficult terrain...

and we dont ahve to scrap the third skill Razz i just need a better idea of what happens

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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Fromundaman on Tue Aug 11, 2009 10:33 pm

Did you see my description for that 3rd skill earlier btw, or do you want me to retype it here?

Also, if you did see it, what do you think?
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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Grass Hopper on Wed Aug 12, 2009 12:23 am

if you could retype it here? unless your talking about the one in your post, which i doubt

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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Fromundaman on Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:23 am

Nah, mentioned it in the XAT, but sure.


Anyway, in DoW, when a Flayed One finished off his opponent, he would dig both clawed hands into the target, lift them up, and hurl them either in front of or behind him (i forget which). Nothing special really happened after that, target just kind of hit the ground and bounced.

Anyway, what I had in mind was making something similar, so that it either be a passive chance when he kills a creep, or an activated ability which insta kills a creep then goes into it, he pick up that creep and throw him at a target point around him, causing the corpse to explode on landing and do AoE damage.
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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Grass Hopper on Wed Aug 12, 2009 12:59 pm

i cant think of a reason that flayed ones would make enemies explode Razz but its a good start of an idea

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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Fromundaman on Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:57 pm

I was just thinking AoE damage when the body lands (I mean, you have a corpse hurled at you, it'll hurt. Since it falls from above... uhh... corpse explosion on landing impact?).

I'll look for something different though.


EDIT: What do you think about this innate btw?

RE-EDIT: This doesn't do much for the hero, but I think it would be cool if you could make him 'phase out' when he dies.
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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by cellrawr on Wed Aug 12, 2009 7:41 pm

Oh, suggestion. If you ever played EotA's Titan hero, he throws his rock which does damage and knocks back whatever it hits. You could do that with the body when its thrown instead of an aoe'ish thing.

Edit: @_@ Wasn't Eota. It was that myth's aos thing. forget name.


Last edited by cellrawr on Thu Aug 13, 2009 4:26 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Grass Hopper on Wed Aug 12, 2009 10:34 pm

that works alot better

edit: oh yeah, that works, but make it do more than just boost his terrifying visage... something in the skill itself? like +str, or +some other bonus

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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Fromundaman on Thu Aug 13, 2009 2:44 am

You know, I honestly think that having up to a +8% chance of the passive taking effect per second was already really good.

However, I was thinking about that today at work, since I would kind of want his skins to do something that would make the bonus reset, making collecting skins (which I don't think would be cooler as a 1-2 sec cannibalize activate skill to harvest, rather than a passive 'get skill on kill' like Gorgutz has, though both work.) worthwhile, and while I don't have a definite idea of how to do it, maybe make skins take a small percent of damage directed at the Flayed One (Soften the blow if you will.), and after a few hits you lose that skin (And I mean that only one skin at a time would absorb say, 1-5% damage per hit, and get shredded off your body in like 3-5 hits maybe?).
That's pretty much the only thing I can think of that makes sense.


Also, for his ulti, I may have an idea, though I have trouble seeing how well it would work out... It took me an hour to figure out what a glancing hit is, but I finally did, and this is the best I can think of implementing Disruption Field atm despite it not being exactly what I thought it was:

Ultimate: Disruption Field
[Effect]
For a short time (15-45 seconds?), the Flayed One's attack is able to warp the skin of his opponent, resulting in a portion of his damage ignoring armor completely and becoming pure damage (50/75/100%? I have trouble seeing how much of an effect this will have. It may also need a damage boost or something.). I was also thinking of an average ulti cooldown (I think that's about 150, right?).
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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Grass Hopper on Thu Aug 13, 2009 1:44 pm

do NOT think thats a weak skill Razz ignoreing armor becomes increadibly powerful late game.. *however* its not codable Razz XD sry... u could make him deal extra pure damage on all attacks or somthing, but its not codeable to change hero attacks to pure damage.

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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by cellrawr on Thu Aug 13, 2009 2:22 pm

<_< oh, you could just make it make it change the hero's attack type to warcraft 3's chaos damage type for the duration. Metamorphosis from demon hunter for example.

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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Grass Hopper on Thu Aug 13, 2009 2:23 pm

chaos damage doesnt ignore armor value, just armor type. chaos in reality is the same as hero damage

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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by cellrawr on Thu Aug 13, 2009 2:38 pm

@_@ Damn

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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Fromundaman on Fri Aug 14, 2009 12:32 pm

Couldnt you debuff his normal attack by 100%, but give hm a +x dmg boost (with X being the dmg he normally deals on each attack before the debuff) for pure dmg?
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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Grass Hopper on Fri Aug 14, 2009 1:32 pm

its also not in the least bit easy to determine the attack damage a hero deals

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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Grass Hopper on Fri Aug 14, 2009 4:12 pm

edited your post a little

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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Fromundaman on Sat Aug 15, 2009 1:36 pm

Gotcha... I'll try to find something else then, but one last suggestion:

Would it be codeable to give him a 100% attack buff and store whatever dmg that buff adds in a variable, then subtract 100% of his dmg (so his damage goes to 0), then add whatever value the variable had as pure dmg?

Otherwise I guess we could just add a certain arbitrary amount or % of attack dmg as pure dmg?
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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Grass Hopper on Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:32 am

theres no way to get a heros damage...
however, the map came with a function to calculate armor, with some ubermathskills... i could take the damage taken, find the armor of the target, and deal damage equal to howevermuch their armor resists

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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Fromundaman on Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:20 pm

Ah, okay. I hadn't quite understood you then. Man, that's kind of stupid of them to make it so hard to get hero damage...

Also Grass, that actually sounds awesome. Probably not easy to code, but it does fit the theme.

Also, would that be workable against Typhus' Feel No Pain, or would it just make his armor reduce damage only on the initial blow?
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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Grass Hopper on Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:25 pm

only on the inital blow. itll still be reduced once after he takes it again. so on all heroes it ignores armor, and on typhus it effectivly halfs his armor Razz

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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

Post by Fromundaman on Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:33 pm

Sounds good if you can get it coded.

So what am I missing now... a more effective 3rd skill, and his innate needs tweaking?

EDIT:

Just now noticed your edit of the OP. I like it!
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Fromundaman
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Re: [HERO] Necrons - Flayed One

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