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Current Version: v0.0.01A

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63% 63% [ 5 ]
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Total Votes : 8

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Version Progress
Changes for v0.02.0A
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Gray Knight

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Gray Knight

Post by cellrawr on Thu Aug 20, 2009 8:57 pm

Been having a lot of complaints on his mana drain aura. Suggest lowering the percentage a lil bit. Also, his ult is a piece of crap. Does very little damage (with the heros oom), and the minor slow on it is the only benefit it has.

Dark suggested giving him another combat ability since right now hes kinda boring to play as. It would be a cleaving attack that affected all enemies within 200 range in front of him, doing damage and slowing them. It would knock them away a little also to balance the slow out, giving it some tactical use as a chase or run away ability.

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Re: Gray Knight

Post by DarkWanderer on Thu Aug 20, 2009 10:58 pm

Yep, Cell and I pretty much agree that he needs some changes; So I'll add my thoughts as well.

His mana drain aura has gotten numerous complaints in our games. So, I think something should definitely be done with that. (A minor nerf on the percentage would probably work)

His ult seems almost completely useless. It doesn't work unless you're right on top of the enemy, and when it does, the damage is terrible compared to even most normal skill nukes.

We both think he needs some other kind of attack skill, such as a charge or aoe attack. As he is now he is a very boring hero to play.

The attack I thought of would be an active ability that effects all units in a half circle in front of him to a max of 200 range ,dealing damage, slowing them slightly, and knocking back a little. I came up with this idea from his halberd weapon. If you don't like my idea, there must be something we can give him, be it from the gray knight's codex or something we think of.

To make room for the skill, Possibly, the aegis could be combined with the shrouding for his innate.

Currently, imo anyway, the gray knight feels like playing a walking mana drain ward.

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Re: Gray Knight

Post by Grass Hopper on Fri Aug 21, 2009 1:04 am

the grey knight is not supposed to be a combat char, hes a tank, hes meant to take hits while pissing off the other team (aura and innate), while still being able to take hits (innate, first skill and +str from nemasis), and punishing them if they leave him around too long (the aura, and his ult)

his ult almost one hits a oom farseer at lvl 25 and no items, at also half kills a lvl 25 oom kharn with no items. its powerful. i might increase the damage per level... and a 600 aoe 30% slow is ahrdly minor.

i dont wanna give him another combat ability because hes already powerful enough. hes got high hp, an annoying as shit aura and innate, a (potentially) powerful crit, (which does stun for a short while btw) and giving him a second slow wont help any, as he already does that with his ult.

the aegis and the shrouding fill two very different roles, and really really shouldnt be combined... the aegis is the knights suit of armor, and the shrouding is the psychic power of the knights obscuring them from their enemies... the aegies allows the grey knight to survive his tanking roll, and the shrouding lets him be a tank, cause if they kill him, then they can hit stuff again. combining the two would make it too powerful of a skill, and then make room for a skill that would make him even more powerful than he already is...
look at the librarian for example, he was a good hero before, and then with the innate, becomes even more of a beast... your basically suggesting giving him 6 skills.

u could call him a walking manadrain ward, but thats oversimplifying things, hes a tank, which by being there, pisses people off enough to attack him. giving him another aoe slow/dmg skill wont change his playstyle

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Re: Gray Knight

Post by Fromundaman on Fri Aug 21, 2009 6:58 am

Quick though:

I don't have the codex on hand atm (not on my comp), but isn't Furious Charge supposed to be a signature Grey Knight skill? (Or is DoW tainting my thinking again?)

Also, while I realize he's a tank (and does that job fairly well), it is true that he's boring to play as. Anything we can change, even slightly, to make him more fun?

As for the aura... I'd need to play against him more often (Haven't played against a decent GK since his bug got fixed.). I thought the range nerf it had received would have done it though.
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Re: Gray Knight

Post by DarkWanderer on Fri Aug 21, 2009 8:31 am

Maybe it was just because I was playing against typhus then. My crits did nothing to him, and after I drained his mana completely my ult had virtually no effect on him either. So compared to typhus as a tank I'd say the gray knight doesn't stand a chance. However, I do remember using his ult on other heroes, and I saw cell do it as well; early game it doesn't seem to do anything. If his ult is only good when everyone is around level 25, I think it needs to be rebalanced so it's effective at all levels. Getting an ult that is useless at lower level just makes him that much more boring to play.

I understand that hes meant to piss everyone off and draw all the aggro to him.

Most complaints about the mana drain aura being too high came from people laning with him in 1vs1 situations where there is no one else to attack him. So early game that mana drain is extremely hard to deal with when you have no mana boosting items.

So, I guess hes going to be that boring hero to play (to me, anyway) who's main purpose is too annoy the other team and take most of the damage, in other words the typical tank. I think I'll play the more combat oriented heroes.

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Re: Gray Knight

Post by Grass Hopper on Fri Aug 21, 2009 9:39 am

well, typhus right now seems to be the ultimate tanking hero, so its not surprising that u dont damage him alot... remembering that fnp reduces damage twice (just thought of a way to nerf him XD)

dealing 50% of a hero's hp is what i call an amazing ult...
however, i agree, maby a level 5 half mana hero wouldnt be afected by it that much, ill prolly increase the %'s on his ult

@fromundaman:
no, grey knights do *not* have furious charge XD they have true grit...
and the aura actually got a range buff... when i nerfed the %'s from 1/2/3/4 to 1/2/2/3... i dont really wanna make it 1/1/2/2 but it looks like uill haev to.

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Heroes:
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Re: Gray Knight

Post by Fromundaman on Fri Aug 21, 2009 11:34 am

Well, I mean at one point only Path could stay out of range, and that's no longer the case. Yeah, I don't play with/against GK much XD
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Re: Gray Knight

Post by cellrawr on Fri Aug 21, 2009 12:36 pm

<.< I think DoW gave Grey Knights Furious Charge since they wouldn't be able to fit in the deep strike tactics they like to use unless you wanted to send them back to base everytime, from.

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Re: Gray Knight

Post by Fromundaman on Fri Aug 21, 2009 12:38 pm

Oh hehe, okay. My bad then.

DoW, stop coloring my perspectives!
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Re: Gray Knight

Post by DarkWanderer on Fri Aug 21, 2009 3:54 pm

Well, I think this has been a very worthwhile debate.

I'm glad to hear that you're going to rework his ult a bit for lower levels, and I hope you follow through with nerfing the percentage on his mana drain aura.

OT - It's Good to know you're nerfing typhus, whom I feel is currently severely overpowered.

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Re: Gray Knight

Post by Grass Hopper on Fri Aug 21, 2009 7:21 pm

basically, ill make his ult do more % of missing mana as damage, and ill make his aura do 1/1/2/2% max mana, and 200/250/250/300 range or something like that...

and for typhus, ill make fnp return magic damage, so armor has less of a massive effect... and if hes still really powerful, then ill make it return pure damage.

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And the Stuff was good.

Heroes:
Commander Farsight (colab - implemented) - Ku'gaath Plaguefather(incomplete) - Ilyana Arienal(incomplete) - Harlequin Shadowseer(incomplete) - Modular Tau Battlesuit(sandbox)
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Re: Gray Knight

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