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[Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by Glycine on Sat Mar 13, 2010 2:31 am

Upon closer examination, he'll need to go for number checking. I'll do the mathcraft later.

*places a hold*
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by ChangerOfWays on Sat Mar 13, 2010 3:33 pm

Damn! This reminds me I have to get back to work on other assassins, any help?
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by Glycine on Sun Mar 14, 2010 2:51 pm

Math on the innate:

10 stacks at max level: +30 strength, +60 agility, +105% attack speed. When dying, does 50% of max hp in AoE around him.

30 stats through ult at max level: +90 strength, +180 agility, +315% attack speed. When dying, does 150% of max HP in AoE around him.

Math on Execution:

At max level: Able to reduce the max health by 425 and the armor of a target by -4. The nuke damage is absolutely pointless because if he does damage to an 800 health hero, the damage will be done first, reducing him to 520 health and then reducing his max health to 425.

Math on Melta Bombs: Does it affect buildings? Not much to be done here. AoE is ridiculous on it though.

Math on Gauntlets:

Let's assume 40 strength from items.

10 stacks gives him 167 strength, so he does 200 extra damage onto his base at max level. Suffers 23 -hp.

30 stacks gives him 227 strength, so he does 273 extra damage. Suffers -63 hp.

Math on Ult: Yeah, this is OP. Not going to even bother. That said, I'll do the touch damage.

10 stacks: 167 strength and 166 Agility (20 off items) = 250 damage per touch.

30 stacks: 227 strength and 286 agility = 400 damage per touch.

Conclusion: NERF THIS. Numberwise mostly.
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by Grass Hopper on Mon Mar 15, 2010 7:01 pm

first thought: hp is reduced before damage is dealt. generally.
and 17*20 is 340 >.>
but im gona remove the damage on the skill cause 340 hp loss is fine enough

and the numbers on the gauntlets and ult will be reduced Razz
they were just random numbers anyway >.>

ult: .1str+.5agi?
3rd: .9str?


Last edited by Grass Hopper on Mon Mar 15, 2010 7:08 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by Glycine on Mon Mar 15, 2010 7:05 pm

Oh, so it does 600 damage in that case. Still doesn't change the conclusion.
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by Grass Hopper on Mon Mar 15, 2010 7:09 pm

edited btw

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Heroes:
Commander Farsight (colab - implemented) - Ku'gaath Plaguefather(incomplete) - Ilyana Arienal(incomplete) - Harlequin Shadowseer(incomplete) - Modular Tau Battlesuit(sandbox)
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by Glycine on Sat Mar 20, 2010 2:01 pm

What exactly did you edit, Grass? It still looks the same.
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by Grass Hopper on Sat Mar 20, 2010 3:51 pm

that it does... i guess the edit didnt save XD now its fixed

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Heroes:
Commander Farsight (colab - implemented) - Ku'gaath Plaguefather(incomplete) - Ilyana Arienal(incomplete) - Harlequin Shadowseer(incomplete) - Modular Tau Battlesuit(sandbox)
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by Glycine on Fri Apr 02, 2010 12:41 am

Hmm, Grass... Praytell you didn't actually overlook the parts that were the most OP? >>

You know, 90 strength, 180 agility, and the ability to explode for 150% hp isn't terribly OP as an ult, or so I guess. Oh yeah, did I mention you added damage to the innate, so he now gains +210 damage from the ult.

In other words..

WHAT THE @!$& are you thinking? I don't even need to play this hero to know that if you give it a boost that big, it's going to kill everything and anything that moves with any instrument it can find. The Ult is supposed to be powerful, but not so much so.

Anyone think that perhaps the reason balance problems come up is because we don't actually catch them when we make the hero's skills in the first place? I'm going to keep talking until this hero is balanced, which is a long time coming.

Although I'd like to hear your rationale for how this is balanced.
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by Grass Hopper on Fri Apr 02, 2010 1:26 am

ok, so lets remove the damage and ias from the innate... cause they are a bit redundant anyway with the +str and +agi

and make his ult only 20 stacks instead of 30.
its a start

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Heroes:
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by ZebioLizard on Tue Apr 13, 2010 10:28 pm

Whoa, what the heck happened here xD Nice!
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by Grass Hopper on Tue Apr 13, 2010 10:55 pm

i cleaned up your suggestion and changed it slightly in some places.
the original is still there

hope your ok with that XD

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And the Stuff was good.

Heroes:
Commander Farsight (colab - implemented) - Ku'gaath Plaguefather(incomplete) - Ilyana Arienal(incomplete) - Harlequin Shadowseer(incomplete) - Modular Tau Battlesuit(sandbox)
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by ZebioLizard on Wed Apr 14, 2010 6:30 am

It works fine for me,
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by 13loodRaven on Thu Apr 15, 2010 2:29 pm

Just remember we dont want too many more super duper nerf-immune carries roaming around out there... Oh and that brings up something, check out item suggestions.

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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by Glycine on Thu Apr 15, 2010 2:50 pm

I've just been ranting about the numbers on the skills for a few months now and wonder if they'll ever be edited. Just me being really pissy about things that should have been fixed a century ago. I really don't know how you can tolerate the amount of stat boost on the ult compared to what other heroes get, but... >>
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by 13loodRaven on Thu Apr 15, 2010 2:58 pm

The stat boost can be kept, just with a really huge price, say like 50% bloodprice or a chance to have a fit after being attacked. Remembering that the eversor is a crazy looney who is seriously unpredictable.

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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by ZebioLizard on Thu Apr 15, 2010 4:32 pm

Pretty much.
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by Glycine on Thu Apr 15, 2010 4:36 pm

Crazy loon he may be, but he doesn't get the ability to go super saiyan 4 when he really does go crazy. ._.

Blood price matters not to someone who's suicidal and is perfectly willing to kill himself to kill you. In fact, since 150% of his life is done as an explosion, if he gets 2k life, that's a 3k explosion guaranteed to kill anything that can't blink out of it.
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by ZebioLizard on Fri Apr 16, 2010 4:06 am

Actually he does have the ability to go super saiyan 4 when he goes crazy, considering at that point, he's so hyped up on drugs he's the equivilant of a meth head vs cops with guns.
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by Glycine on Fri Apr 16, 2010 7:34 am

And yet we have an Avatar of Khaine, a C'tan, and a Carnifex, all of which could pretty much pummel the assassin into the ground even while crazy. The point I'm trying to make is that while going stat crazy may be fun, it's not even remotely balanced. I mean, Void Dragon could probably control all the machinery in the map if he wanted to and make your drop pods explode. Or he could make your turrets turn on you.

Actuality does not confer reality. >>
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by 13loodRaven on Fri Apr 16, 2010 12:40 pm

Indeed, take the dreadnoughts and kans for exsample, they should rape a large group of infantry within a matter of moments but hey..

Ok say if the explosion succeeds, say theres an extra 5-10 seconds extra respawn time for each hero killed?

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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by Glycine on Fri Apr 16, 2010 1:29 pm

That's my point. xD

He's too hopped up on bonuses to be a realistic hero. 180 agility? Really now? Plus 70 damage for the ult?

So his stats with ult at level 25 are... This is assuming he's an agility hero. If he's a strength hero, numbers will be adjusted, but my point will have been made anyway.

Strength: 97 base + 20 item + 60 ult = 177 strength --> 150 + 177*20 = 3690 health
Agility: 86 base + 30 item + 180 ult = 296 agility --> -2 base armor + 296/10 +10 item = 37.6 armor
Int: 84 base + 15 item = 99 int --> 1485 mana.

Attack speed is: 1.77 * 100/(100+296*2+315) = .175 second cd on attacks. But that's raised to .34 for heroes anyway. >>

Effective HP due to armor: 3690 * (1+(37.6*0.06)) = 12014 health, yay. >> If he gets a holosuit, which gives 25% evasion, that number goes up to 16k health.

Damage: 296 base from agi + 70 from ult + 50 from items = 416 damage.

If we turn on gauntlets and then ult:
416 base + 177 * 0.9 = 575 damage per hit. Of course, he'll drain 63 damage a second, but if he gets 10% life steal, he gains back... 57.5 life? What a rather nice coincidence.

Now then. I *dare* you to say that these numbers are balanced and that the Eversor will be perfectly fine. We gave Kharn less bonuses for his ult and even those are being scaled down. ._.
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by 13loodRaven on Fri Apr 16, 2010 2:47 pm

Maybe this hero should be reserved for titans mode O.o

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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by Son007 on Fri Apr 16, 2010 2:57 pm

Glycine did you add the +20 bonus stats? Its not in base because its bonus stats.
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

Post by Glycine on Fri Apr 16, 2010 5:29 pm

Yeah, I added the bonus stats automatically to base at level 25. So don't worry, he can't get possibly more powerful.... >>
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Re: [Incomplete] Eversor Temple Assassin

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