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[Incomplete] Novice-Librarian Scamander Of The Soul Drinkers

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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Tue Sep 15, 2009 5:17 pm

GrassEdit(( ok, so im gona fix this up a bit, add stats etc, and u still need to come up with his story [Incomplete] Novice-Librarian Scamander Of The Soul Drinkers Icon_razz

Scamader of the Soul Drinkers - Novice-Librarian

Story:
Due to many years under the influence of tzeentch, many powerful psykers started apearing amongst the ranks of the soul drinkers. One of them was scmanader. Although he was a novice librarian, he was one of the most powerful in the chapter. He could create massive destruction but had a very grave price. He sapped the heat from himself and everything around him be it living, dead, friend or foe. He quickly joined his chapter's chief librarian Sarpedon on his quest to redeem his chapter.

Stats:
->strength: 19 + 2.2
agility: 16 + 1.7
intelligence: 23 + 2

range: melee? if not, prolly 600 range.
movespeed: 300

innate: Inner Fire-
Scamander draws most of his power from his body heat, fueling his destructive rage with his own life force. However, Scamander suffers backlashes from his spells to give him time to regain his body heat. Scamander gains 2/2.5/3/3.5/4/4.5 hp and mana per second, but suffers negative effects 8 seconds after he casts a spell.
Fireblast: Scamander is stunned for 1.5/1.4/1.3/1.2/1.1/1 seconds.
Flame Bath: takes 30 dps, and loses 1/1.75/1.5/1.25/1/0.75 armor and 6/5.5/5/4.5/4/3.5% as per second for 5 seconds
Hellfire: looses 6/6/5/5/4/4 armor, 40/40/30/33/20/20% as, and 30/30/25/25/20/20% damage.
(note to kharn: i gave the innate its own sperate effects, and merged the spell backlashes into the innate)

one: Fireblast-
Scamander conjures up a firey bolt of energy and hurls it at the target, dealing 100/150/200/250 damage, and stunning them for 1.25/1.5/1.75/2 seconds.

two: Flame Bath-
Scamander covers his enemy in molten fire slowly melting their armor and burning the target. Deals 45/50/55/60 damage per second to target enemy, and reduces their armor by .25/.4/.75/1 and attack speed by 3/4/5/6% per second
[size=9] inferno was the aoe lol flame bath was a single target

three: Soulfire-
The pure burning energy inside Scamander is almost uncontrollable, manifesting itself whenever psychic energy is used. Whenever a spell is cast around Scamander, enemies in a 600/650/700/750 range take damage equal to .1/.125/.17/.25x Scamanders intelligence.

ult: Hellfire-
Scamander exhausts himself to incinerate everything in the target area. Units caught in the blase take 100/150/200 damage, suffer 15/30/45 40/60/72 damage per second for 8 seconds, and become snared for 3/6/8 3/4/5 seconds.

ok, so i edited soulfire a little, added stats, and finished up some skills... make and comments/changes u want

))GrassEdit


Spoiler:
he would be either int or str and the idea here is scamander has the ability to manipulate temperature (create fire) by sacrificing his own body heat and the heat around him so all his moves will be powerful with a drawback

Innate
Inner Fire- scamander has spent time ti better develop his inner body heat to the point where he is stunned for .2/.4/.6/.8/1 second less on fireball, is slowed for 4/5/6/7/8% less from inferno, and his armor is only reduced by .10/.20/.30/.40/.50 per sec and his as by 1.0/1.5/2.0/2.5/3% less, and hell fire only reduces armor by 1.5/2/2.5 less as/ms by 10/15/20$ less and damage by 5/10/15% less

Skill 1
Fireblast- scamander send a fiery bolt at the target dealing 100/150/200/250 dmg and stunning them for .5/1/1.5/2 secs but scamander will be stunned for .5/1/1.5/2 secs after 15 8 seconds to give his body time to regain its heat

Skill 2
Inferno- scamanders takes the heat of everything around him and creates a massive inferno for 4 secs doing 45/50/55/60 a second and slowing himself, allies, and enemies alike for 4/8/12/16% for 5/6/7/8 seconds due to a lack of body heat
Soulfire: Each spell does 1% more damage for every 10/8/6/5 str or int
Fluff could read something like: Scamanders fiery abilities cause the very essence of his psyker nature to be bathed in flames causing scamanders powers to become that much deadlier


Skill 3
FLame bath- scamanders covers the enemy in flames doing 45/50/55/60 dmg a sec for 5 seconds and reducing their armor by .25/.50/.75/1 per sec but 15 secs later scamander will suffer a similar dot tht reduces his armor by .25/.50/.75/1 per sec for 5 secs and his as by 3/4/5/6% per sec due to his armor nearly freezing

Ult
Hellfire- scamanders targets an area of 150/300/450 AoE and sets it abalze sapping all heat from every thing living or dead around him hellfire cause 100/150/200 initial damage and then snares everyone in the aoe for 8 secs causeign 15/30/45 dmg a sec seeing as how they've been almost melted to the ground 8 seconds after the initial damage scamander loses 3/4/5 armor, 15/30/45% ms/as, and 10/20/30% damage

meh skeleton haha work time hope i get feedback [Incomplete] Novice-Librarian Scamander Of The Soul Drinkers Icon_razz


Last edited by Betrayer_kharn on Fri Sep 25, 2009 12:35 pm; edited 5 times in total

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Post by walt_jabsco on Tue Sep 15, 2009 6:53 pm

i like it he does seem to have much more potential then sarpedon skills wise cool idea
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Post by Grass Hopper on Tue Sep 15, 2009 10:34 pm

would it kill you to post in the right forums? Sad Razz and looks good Very Happy i always like your heroes XD

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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Tue Sep 15, 2009 10:54 pm

well to me the right place to post a SUGGESTED or INCOMPLETE HERO would be in the heroes>suggested/incomplete thats just me lmao Razz

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Post by Grass Hopper on Tue Sep 15, 2009 10:57 pm

its kinda a multi tierd system: first u suggest it, then if its well accepted (not everyone hates it XD) and i like it and can see it being in the map, it gets moved to development, depending on how developed the idea is, it goes in one of the sub forums.. and good point, ill remove the suggested part from that forum Razz )

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And the Stuff was good.

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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Tue Sep 15, 2009 10:59 pm

lmao wht to do wht to do Razz ima work on a tyrendian and a gresk tyrendian manipulates lightning and gresk manipulates the adrenaline and combat abilities of his brother

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Post by Fromundaman on Wed Sep 16, 2009 8:54 am

I like this one a lot to be honest. Seems like a very tough hero to use, but rewarding when used right.
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Post by Grass Hopper on Wed Sep 16, 2009 11:58 am

the only thing im not liking is the 4 nukes Razz

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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Wed Sep 16, 2009 1:33 pm

well like i said hes like that cause he packs a huge punch but with serious side effects thats why he has 4 powerful nukes with side effects Razz

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Post by Glycine on Wed Sep 16, 2009 2:46 pm

4 nukes is quite too much.

If he was an str hero, I would laugh every time as he ran out of mana before casting his third nuke early game. EVERY TIME.

He has no flexibility as well, since all you're doing is casting spells. Magic Resist, Iron Halo, and Animus Speculum would really good against him, especially with that mana burn. Razz

IF *insert hint here* there happened to be an item that gave a % chance to silence, Scamander's fucked royally.

Give him something that makes him more survivable, because he's going to get picked apart end-game by dps-heroes who invest in magic resist.
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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Wed Sep 16, 2009 2:58 pm

well i could take that and look at lord of change or zoanthrope i could apply the same principle invest into magic resistance and those heroes now become screwed because now they do less magic damage. so should we change the scheme of both of those heroes?. and i disagree with the no felxibility all of his nukes have a separate effect and a seprate debuff which makes them right in the rigth situations and not so right in other situations.

so i dont htink he's as unflexible as u claim and im sorry but the reasoning behind the since he nukes magic resist so we need to change his nukes doest apply or we have to change zoanthrope and lord of change.

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Post by Grass Hopper on Wed Sep 16, 2009 3:27 pm

LoC is prolly the best disabler in the game, and zoey has his scream to counter magic resist and his aura and blast can disable

my worry, was that he has 4 nukes that can rape anyones shit without trying

he has a target 2 second stun, two aoe slows, and an armor reducition. PLUS epic damage from 4 nukes

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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Wed Sep 16, 2009 3:43 pm

all with epic draw backs if u feel they are powerful then increase the drawbacks. Because in the soul drinkers books scamander is extremely powerful but can't sustain the power for long seeing as how it uses his body heat mainly. so make the drawbacks bigger or sooner but hes supposed to be strong. and also 3/4 nukes are DoTs i did this cause i wanted the end total damage to be high and be reduced each time which in the end equals the same but makes it do less for each tick so hp regen/lifesteal/healing/magic reducing abilities (e.g. termi armor could be activated after the nuke is initiated and absorb it) make it do less damage in the sense that theres more down time in 200 dmg over 5 secs or 300 dmg in 1 sec

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Post by Grass Hopper on Wed Sep 16, 2009 3:56 pm

250 + 240(dot) + 300(dot) + 200 + 360(dot)
after... 8 seconds... they can take 1150 damage, while being slowed, stuned, and have no ias/armor... its a bit too much... yes it does have drawbacks, but its still imensly powerful. (not to mention 4 nukes is less fun XD, gogo hit 4 buttons... ok im done... now what).

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Post by Glycine on Wed Sep 16, 2009 4:04 pm

OOC:

I'm just going to say this outside of the normal discussion before I start. Do you think a Novice-Librarian would have such immense psyker potential to even wield 4 spells in conjunction? Even the Chapter Master, Sarpedon, has only 2 spells, and the Deathwatch Codicier has 2 spells as well.

You can't base a character solely off nukes, because it's not logical to have a AoS character only cast spells. What does that say about the character? He's either incredibly weak or there's nothing else he's notable or good at, which is very lame. It's like a Space Marine being able to only move in straight lines. >>


IC:

There's a difference between spells and nukes. Spells don't have to necessary do damage to be effective. Nukes, however, must do damage to be effective. For example, Lord of Change's horror causes a fear effect.

As for the LoC and Zoey....
Lord of Change and Zoey do get screwed by magic resist and I understand that. In the like, so will your hero. I want Lord of Change to receive a few modifications as to not be so good, for one, but new heroes will counter him plenty.

Lord of Change does need his nukes/spells because he's connected to Tzeentch, the Chaos God of Change and more importantly of psychic and warp abilities. Zoey is the primary psychic creature of the Tyranids, so he should have a barrage of spells. If you were a giant floating head, I doubt you'd be good at anything but casting spells and nukes.

I do enjoy the various effects and countereffects proposed, but did you think about how he would perform in gameplay? He would be screwed every 15 seconds after he cast a spell and later in game, he'll be a liability because:

1) he's most likely an int. hero. Sorry, but int. heroes in general don't do as well as they have in the end-game.
2) His spells don't scale. That means a Carnifex or Grey Knight can simply take your spells and charge in, or a jumper like Celestine, Bloodthirster, etc can take your nukes and hop into melee range, where they'd proceed to rape you.
3) Your character needs every spell he can get, which means that he wouldn't be leveling the innate, making each spell hurt harder to you than it does to another. And I will be frank about your ult. At level 3, it sets you up to get hit so hard, it's not amusing. -45% ms? That's a stun, for all purposes, and dps heroes will pounce on you so hard, the hero would be a perpetual feed.
4) Other int heroes outdamage you by a lot and there's no additional protection for him. He's a glass cannon, with the potential to do ~1100 damage in a span of 10 seconds, but he doesn't have a lot of life or armor and when his spells are on cooldown (literally), he'll be easy prey. @s grass noted, he does a lot of damage when his spells are up, but when they're down... And playing a nuker isn't fun if you don't give him other abilities that complement his spells without actually doing damage.

While I won't go so far to say your logic is faulty, it has a few holes in it.
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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Wed Sep 16, 2009 4:07 pm

ok so lemme change all the drawback to after 8 seconds now yes u did that damage to them (again in dots which if you do al lthe math will turn up at less damage than an all out nuke) now you did that damage but you're stunned for 2 secs,slowed by 56%, 75% less as, -10 armor, and -30% damage at the stage of doing 1150 damage they should have close to if not more then that in health or be able to withstand with armor put into the equation (with jstu 33% dmg reduction uve now take 1/3 of it making it 770.5) and if they survive could mroe then easily come back and kill me seeing as how now i am basically usless. this is at lvl 13 be4 any1 innates do antyhing and if you put all ur points into your skills

and i disagree again ur lookign at just the nueks neither of you have yet looked at the side effects of the nukes which now take place at 8 secs so to do this damage u have to suffer severe consequences

so for the third time now if ur going to calculate all the damge then calculate all the other variable (armor,health, and the debuffs) obviously if you look at jsut the damage then yes its powerful but 1150 damage for a 2 sec stun followed by a 56% ms slow a 75% as slow a -10 armor and -30% damage (nearly 1/3 of your damage) its not that big

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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Wed Sep 16, 2009 4:20 pm

ok well not really on your first point you obviously have no idea who the soul drinkers are or you wouldnt say that.
FYI: soul drinkers were a branch of the crimson fists who took a different approach to what the imperium should be. ANd sought that idea over the emperor's. so they sought the help of a greaterd demon of tzeentch (notable for their psychic powers i remind you). they didnt know he was chaos at first but non the less followed him. this in turn corrupted his chapter and provided the many mutations in the chapter (e.g. sarpedon's legs) and they have since left the path of chaos and are trying to correct it. also scamander is noted for hi immense power even as a novice-librarian but he is new to it and it is very random in effectiveness i simply took this and combined it with the side effect of his powers thus the debuffs. so i am sorry but your logic is the one flawed here. please before u questions someones logic on this matter KNOW THE FLUFF and thank you Smile


1. no you could inded make him strength it would ismply make you focus on mana regen items as opposed to str items (e.g. chap master consumes VAST amounts of mana but is still a str hero)
2. that's the point but what i dont get is first you say 4 nukes to much (obv reffering to to much damage and to many active nukes) and now you say that it wouldnt be enough? so im confused here
3.&4. i disagree the i designed it as such so you take maximum penalties at lower levels and less damage at higher levels with the innate its close to 22.%5 ms reduction so no its not 45% (again if your going to look at the number look at all of them) and liek i stated earlier u could ver ywell make him str he would simply require more mana regen but as for ur final point that ENTIRELY depends on ur paly style some1 with all nukes is my type of character they have fast burst capability and lots of it with medium-long downtime thats how i liek to play i would hope that all of you understand this by now u might not enjoy that approach as much but u cant say simply because you wouldn't enjoy playing him that means every1 else wouldnt enjoy him as well cause thats entirely false Smile

as i stated your logical was in reality the flawed one you questioned his psychic abilities without knowing his fluff and u stated that simply because you dotn enjoy playign a nuker everyone else wouldn't enjoy playing him as well which is in now way logical.... but thank you for contradicitng yourself Smile

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Post by Glycine on Wed Sep 16, 2009 5:28 pm

Cooldown, Kharn, cooldown. Your skills don't have a 5 second cooldown, with all their fun effects.

1) I'd love to know the mana cost for all of the skills, especially if he's a strength hero. Mana Regen items don't make your mana instantly appear, especially with Str. Heroes.

2) Scaling is what makes a hero effective. Although he does too much damage at level 16, at level 25, he won't do enough damage to make him effective.

3) Please read what I've said about 3. Please. For the sake of all that is holy. You won't have ANY points in innate unless you give up putting points in all your nukes, which will hurt your effectiveness either way. you either do lots of damage but suffer bad effects or don't do enough damage to be effective.

Late game, I acknowledge that the innate will help spare a lot of those bad effects, but in the early-mid game, he'll be hit hard.

4) I actually enjoy playing nukers like the Lord of Change and Fuegan. But all their spells aren't solely nukes, which makes them more interesting characters to play. It's like playing with a unit that can only do one thing extremely well. Some people may like it, some may not, but he would be better as a character if all his skills didn't solely consist of nukes.



As for the damage and effects stuff.

Let's have a hypothetical timeline of events.

0:00: Scamander and another hero meet. Pretend he has no points in innate yet.

0:01: Scamander casts Fire Blast to initiate combat, doing 250 damage and a 2 sec stun.

0:01.5-2.5: Scamander casts Inferno and Flame Bath with hotkeys. Total damage done so far is 250 with a 0.5 secs left on the stun.

0:04-0:12: Here's the meat of things. Basically in this duration, Scamander casts Hellfire which does 560 damage total. Additionally, Flame Bath and Inferno do their full damage in this duration, which adds up to 540 damage. Grand total of damage is ~900 damage. However, the negative effects also occur in this timeline.

0:07-0:15: Scamander is slowed as well as the enemy for 16(Cool% of ms in this duration due to Inferno.

0:09: Scamander is stunned for 2(1) seconds.

0:13-???: Scamander suffers a loss of 5(2.5) armor, 45(22.5)% as/ms, and 30(15)% damage due to the Hellfire for an unknown duration

0:17-0:22-->???: Scamander feels the negative effects of Flame Bath and loses a total of 5(2.5) armor and 30(15)% ias for an unknown duration.

That makes it seem bad, so sorry about that, but I had to paint a picture. So Scamander's the best in the first 10 seconds, but once he uses his skills, he'll be vulnerable for a period.

While I've read Soul Drinkers Literature, I do humbly apologize for not knowing every little detail.

I have put forth the facts to the best of my judgment and have no complaints. If it so happens that I have erred, then I'll acknowledge my error and correct it.
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Post by walt_jabsco on Wed Sep 16, 2009 5:44 pm

mabey to make him contend later game u could replace the dot -armor with a soul burn type move that silences and reduces dmg done also i was thinking a passive called mentoring tyrendian or something like that where it makes all his moves inc based on int or str like an alll around scaling buff to all moves or mabey and activateable move that like stores up over time or percast that when activated inc dmg or reduces effects
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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Wed Sep 16, 2009 6:11 pm

dont assume because i point out your flaws i am angry u simply said my logical was flawed with flawed logical so i corrected you.

you can succesfully start putting points into ur innate at lvl 16+ u stated end game he would be useless end game is not 1-14 end game is more 18-25 so again he would have his innate kicking in and the full effectiveness of all his skills

secondly i alrdy stated this about scamander the whole idea is to not use all your nueks at once but to use ur nukes at appropriate times so all the debuffs dont effect you and even so if you do use all your moves its only fully ill-effected at 1-15 16+ and the innate starts to kick in fairly well. so again the idea here is to properly use his skills to be effective early game so as not to hinder urself to much and secondly late game you will be bale to all out nuke them with little ill effects

yet again stating the idea behind him is to force you to time your moves properly as you and grass stated hitting 4 keys then breaking is boring well this in a way forces you to not hit those 4 keys at the same time but space them properly throughout the fight to make the best advantage of their effects at the time.
(e.g. open with flame bath, when the debuff kicks in use hellfire and then inferno wait a little and then for the remainder of the debuff from hellfire use fireblast stunning them giving you more time to recooperate and 8 seconds to get to a safe destination or kill the enemy hero for tht matter)

so yes the order you did it was bad but there is a smart/rational/and logical order you can do it in that makes the ill effects the least effective and other will devise other ways as well

again i disagree again thats opinion based to me although he has 4 nueks they each have helpful side-effects which in turn make the timing of these skills so they work as well together as possible impecable so he would be a challenging and fun hero to me seeing as how itd be less of a cast order and mroe of a priorirty order (e.g. if this happens i should use this spell not use spell 1 then spell 2 then ult then spell 3)

i have no problem with you not having a knowledge of soul drinkers but do not call another person's logic out if you do not know the reasoning by it you said to me that he shouldnt be able to do what he does as a novice librarian because even the chapter master cant cast that much and this is because a.) sarpedon's ONLY psychich prowess is the hell he can only project/receive thoughts that's it scamander on the otherhand ahs av ery offensive and powerful spell. and u base it on a standard chapter librarian which is ignorant of the fact that the soul drinkers were guided by tzeentch. so i have no problem with you not knowing their fluff but when u know you dont know their story u have no place tellign someone they are wrong.

so again i beleive he would be an extremely fun character simply because his spells are more along the lines of a balancing act then a o i hit 4 keys = gg 1337ness and that you say hes not fin based on only one single cast order in which u use all spells successivley when he was designed to again properly time those spells to make the best out of the ill effects i wanted to gear away from a standard hit 4 keys and mroe towards a situational priority system which is why he is the way he is

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Post by Grass Hopper on Wed Sep 16, 2009 10:33 pm

think of it like this: 1v1, enemy stands no chance till level 16 (at which point, he still pretty much rapes because of epic debuffs on the enemy, he only might die late late game 1v1 because farm > nukes)
in a team battle, u can wtfown one hero, and get completly owned later when the negatives kick in, or u can share the fun, make it ezier for your team, and still get owned, when the negatives kick in
(your innate doest make him scale, it makes him suffer less by himself)
and if u dont chain cast your nukes, then your waisting potential. because a nuker (your hero) is *meant* to nuke. and if hes not nuking, then hes useless. so you can blow your cooldowns and be useless to the fight, or you can stagger your casts, and cast when its *appropraite* and have *distnctly* less effect on the outcome of the battle (he has 4 nukes, thats all he can do, is use his spells. if hes not doing that. hes useless => no (real)passives, no buffs, no short cooldown spells, no dps capabilities, nothing but his nukes)

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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Thu Sep 17, 2009 9:24 am

again i highly disagree as i pointed out in my cast order you can very easily have extreme potential while properly spacing out your nukes so think of it like this. 1v1 you can do tremendous damage whenever needed while still avoid the full draw backs of your spells. in a team battle again your teams there so you can easily space your nukes out properly and stil not get wtfowned his innate is onyl designed to reduce the debuffs on himself it makes his nukes debuffs on himself half which is in a way scaling further you get into the game your debuffs scale down to have less of an effect on you. and no a pure nuker but a majority of pure nuker (e.g. zoa) dont have many side effects with their abilities zoa has 1 slow thts extremely easy to avoid. he on the other hand has disabling abilities that prevent you enemy from running. and as i showed earlier with my cast order he would not lose dps potential at all he would simply effectivels maximize making the best out of his loss's (debuffs). and again if you space them out properly you can still be extremely effective whilst not using all 4 nueks at the same time. because yet again ALL his nukes have a time and palce where they are most effective and its designed to make you use them at that point. i can 100% guarantee if u amde this hero i would easily prove both you wrong and be effective in both 1v1's and team battle's at both late and early game because again his spells are based on a priority system. not a spam 4 keys then have tremendous downtime.

and in that last point u contradict yourself u state i can wtfown any one hero either 1v1 or in a team battle (which obviously means he has extreme dps burst capabilities) then you state he has no dps capabilities so im a litle confused which is either he has great dps or he has no dps? but u cant wtfown a player if you have no dps capabilities its simply impossible...

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Post by Glycine on Thu Sep 17, 2009 10:52 am

*facepalm*

Ok, I'd like to see what a hero with four nukes would do.

Against Grey Knight.
Against Zoanthrope.
Against Lord of Change and the Librarian.
Against Carnifex or Hive Tyrant, who will take your 1150 nuke and still come after you.

I'd even like to participate in testplay of him, just to show that a character with 4 nukes is a one-trick pony, and no matter how you stagger out the nukes to keep nuking, you're only going to have so much mana to use in a team battle.
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Post by DeusMechanicus on Thu Sep 17, 2009 12:25 pm

And now for something completely different ... Didn't the Imperial Fists wtfpwn the Soul Drinkers in the last book?
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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Thu Sep 17, 2009 3:19 pm

@deus i couldnt tell you
@glyc ok hive tyrant is not even in existence so can in now way be used as an example and even still u have presented 4 heroes out of 28 possible heroes thats 14.3% thats a little less then 1 out of 7 heroes that he would have trouble dealing with and with all characters you can find an equally powerful counter so really that's a useless example. All you stated was you could beat a hero with his counter
*claps* wow your skills at stating the obvious are absolutely extraordinary

u cant simply say a heroes useless because a character designed to counter his type of character can beat him that proves nothing simply that he's not as powerful as he was first claimed to be and that he will indeed be able to be defeated proving the right counters.

and again one-trick pony in this sense states all he can do is tremendous burst damage which is a false statement in itself because all his burst damage has some sort of side effect that would prove more useful in certain instances than others. and if it's a team battle you only need so much mana because you will more then likely not last long enough for you to only get your nukes off once. which in a team battle is all you should need because if its a team battle it is a team effort.

so to sum up what you've stated my hero has counters, you could beat my hero using his counters, and he would be able to cast more then once in a team battle
(first two are true but obvious........... last one is simply false u would only need the mana to cast our nuke once which can be provided with the proper stat distribution)

saying u can beat me with a coutner so he would fail is liek saying sine greay knight or carni can beat zoa well that means zoa is wrong and needs to be fixed.... so is this what you think? no u obviously dont feel that way or you woulda stated it when we were designing him.

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