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Current Version: v0.0.01A

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[Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation I_vote_lcap63%[Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation I_vote_rcap 63% [ 5 ]
[Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation I_vote_lcap38%[Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation I_vote_rcap 38% [ 3 ]

Total Votes : 8

Latest topics
» With everyone dead
[Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 20, 2018 3:24 pm by DeusMechanicus

» Faction creeps
[Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation I_icon_minitimeSun Dec 21, 2014 12:49 am by Grass Hopper

» [SCII] [Inquisition] Hector Rex
[Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 18, 2014 9:06 am by Grass Hopper

» [necrons] Orikan, the Diviner
[Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 16, 2014 5:58 pm by Grass Hopper

» Talent System
[Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 15, 2014 10:59 am by Grass Hopper

» Capture Points system
[Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 12, 2014 2:36 pm by Grass Hopper

» [SCII] [Orks] Warboss(es)
[Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 12, 2014 11:44 am by Grass Hopper

» Game Guide
[Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 11, 2014 2:12 pm by Grass Hopper

» [Inquisition] Mordrak
[Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 10, 2014 3:28 pm by Grass Hopper

» [inquiition] Kaldor Draigo
[Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 10, 2014 3:07 pm by Grass Hopper

Version Progress
Changes for v0.02.0A
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[Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation

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[Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation Empty [Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation

Post by Betrayer_kharn on Sun Sep 27, 2009 2:54 pm

Backstory: Throughout the war between the old ones and the NIghtbringer THe deceiver stood in the back using each and every one of them as a chess piece on his own chess board. Ha manipulates everyone and anyone he talks to will do his bidding whether they will to or not. During the war he told the nightbringer that the other star gods have mroe power then mere humans. THis cause the nightbringer to hun star gods and feast on them which made his hunger for power even greater. After feasting on star gods mere humans couldnt sustain him anymore so when thousand of alien ships attacked his tomb world thanks to directions of the deceiver he was unable to go into stasis and so slowly lost his power. This allowed the deceiver to be a priamry force in the univers and to this day still manipulates everything he lays his eyes on all for his own goal that no being not even Tzeentch can see.

Ms: 310
Stats
Str- 18 + 1.9
Agi- 15 + 1.8
Int- 27 + 2.4

Innate: Epidermis
fluff: the c'tan arem ight beings of energy and are only allowed to walk because they are in a living metal tha gives them form
effect: gives the deceiver 1/2/3/4/5 armor and 1/2/3/4/5 bonus hp regen also whenever the deceiver is killed his true form is unleahsed doing 50/125/200/275/350 damage to everything, friend or foe, in a 400 aoe 2 seconds after his death

Skill 1: Grand Illusion
fluff: The deceiver uses his god like abilities to creat a replica army of everything he see
effect: target a 200/300/400/500 aoe everything in that aoe is copied creating an illusion of them that takes 300/275/250/225% damage and do 20/30/40/50% damage to anything they attack

Skill 2: Misdirect
fluff: with but a whim the deceiver leaves combat leaving an illusion in his wake to distract the enemy as he retreats to better assess the situation
effect: creates a clone of the deceiver that takes 200/175/150/125% damage and does no damage but when the clone is created the deceiver becomes invisible increasing ms by 10/15/20/25% for 5/6/7/8 seconds

skill 3: Manifestation of Power
fluff: being a god of tremendous power all enemies or allies can see this and are effected by his very presence
effect: enemies have a 10/15/20/25% to be afflicted with a curse reducing their chance to hit by 33% and allies have a similar chance to not want to fail in the eyes of a god so fight harder receivng a 33% damage buff the buff or debuff lasts for 6/8/10/12 seconds

Ultimate: Dread
fluff: the deceiver manipulates the perceptions of an enemy in causing them to see taht which they worship which makes them want to sacrifice themselves for this greater being
effect: target unit walks towards the deciever and start to drop his armor and weapons giving him -4/5/6 armor for 4/5/6 seconds then suddenyl regains control of his mind but due to this extreme illusion he loses 30/40/50% as from dropping his weapons and 10/15/20% ms for 3/4/5 secs after

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Post by Fromundaman on Sun Sep 27, 2009 4:47 pm

Ummm... I made this hero literally 2 and a half hours ago... wtf?

That being said, I like your misdirect skill, but your grand illusion skill is OP, as well as not really at all like the TT skill.

Epidermis doesn't really fit in in this skillset though...
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Post by Grass Hopper on Sun Sep 27, 2009 7:05 pm

im trying to decide whos i like more Razz

that being said, epidermis doesnt fit this theme Razz grand illusions is deserving of an ult, and dread doesnt make sense to me fluffwise.

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And the Stuff was good.

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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Sun Sep 27, 2009 10:42 pm

ehh i forgot to rename dread lol but grand illusion lets you redeploy ypur unit tt wise so seeing as how its moves what was previously there and its called grand illusion i made it like that and actually youre very wrong about the op part its really not even that powerful just good for creating quick meat shields ive played an aos where a similar skilled was used and all it did was help push and not like super well just meh

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Post by Fromundaman on Sun Sep 27, 2009 11:21 pm

Let's picture a scene for a minute:

You are in a situation where both sides try to gank, or one side pushes and one defends, or something like that. You have creeps here and there, and say a minimum of 4 heroes in that area (not all allied).

You use Grand Illusion. Now you've got twice as many creeps, half of these under your control, making creep blocking/boxing them easier, and now you also have 4 more heroes, all who do 50% of their original damage, at your disposal.

How is this not OPed?
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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Mon Sep 28, 2009 5:03 am

on paper it seems bad but as i have told you which you obviously paid no heed to i have played and aos that had a very similar skill except they did more damage took less and it had a range of 1.2k i beleive and it still wasnt that bad and i like how u neglect to mention they take 200% more damage so 1-2 aoe's has now cleared your "op" army

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Post by Fromundaman on Mon Sep 28, 2009 9:49 am

Saying it wasn't OP in a potentially completely different, unnamed AoS is not proof of anything. So yes, I did see you say that, but it really doesn't mean much to me on its own.

Right, I realize they take 200%, but let's take Lellith's illusions, who all deal 50% and take 300%. She is currently insanely good because of the damage output she can pull out when used right.
This would be similar (50% damage, can potentially have a bunch of cloned hero units, but get creeps too), but they take less damage. Sure, the CD and manacost is probably going to be higher, but still.

Finally, it doesn't seem very hard to box in an opponent with that many units. Hell, it's pretty easy to creep block people with Chapter Master as is due to his focus fire skill.

On a side note, what AoS was this?
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Post by Grass Hopper on Mon Sep 28, 2009 12:13 pm

(leliths illusions deal 40% damage, she can get 4, shes a fucking beast, and shes an agi character... getting illusions of potentially 5+heroes, some of whome may be str/high str heroes, PLUS creeps, from both sides... is... less than balanced Razz)

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And unto the masses, He doth spoke:
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And the Stuff was good.

Heroes:
Commander Farsight (colab - implemented) - Ku'gaath Plaguefather(incomplete) - Ilyana Arienal(incomplete) - Harlequin Shadowseer(incomplete) - Modular Tau Battlesuit(sandbox)
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Post by Fromundaman on Mon Sep 28, 2009 12:27 pm

Oops. Thought it was 50%.

So these illusions also do more damage... Shocked
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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Mon Sep 28, 2009 8:48 pm

and are also alot weaker change the stas for hero illusion if yo uwant but i 100% guarantee both of you its not as bad as you're making it seem, as i stated i played with a are that was 1200 radius around him so 2400 aoe and it wasnt even that bad, also its a 600 aoe 300 radius to fit 5+ heores and 8 creeps in that ud have to get very damned lucky............

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Post by Grass Hopper on Mon Sep 28, 2009 8:50 pm

pssst: aoe is measured in radius [Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation Icon_razz

also, in comparison to lileath (seems to be the best comparison [Hero] Deceiver C'tan of Manipulation Icon_razz)
it takes her... 2 minutes to get 4 illusions of herself... yet u could easily get 4+ illusions instantly like that...

no, i dont think that its completly broken, but its way too powerful for a basic skill

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And the Stuff was good.

Heroes:
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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Mon Sep 28, 2009 9:01 pm

well my aoe is a 300 radius 600 total if u want me to put that up there then fine and so far ur biggest complaint has been the heroes again good luck fitting 5+ heores and 8 creeps into a 300 radius 600 aoe circle and even so if your really that worrie (even though neither of you have ever played any aos with a skill similar to this) then lower the number for heroes not that hard of a fix.....

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Post by Fromundaman on Mon Sep 28, 2009 10:13 pm

Betrayer_kharn wrote:well my aoe is a 300 radius 600 total if u want me to put that up there then fine and so far ur biggest complaint has been the heroes again good luck fitting 5+ heores and 8 creeps into a 300 radius 600 aoe circle and even so if your really that worrie (even though neither of you have ever played any aos with a skill similar to this) then lower the number for heroes not that hard of a fix.....

Well, I have asked you what AoS this was, and have yet to get a response, so that I might play it and see.
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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Mon Sep 28, 2009 11:44 pm

ive stated it twice 600 AoS which to me means a 600 diamter of a circle which equals a 300 radius so you have gotten a response you simply did not see it

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Post by Grass Hopper on Mon Sep 28, 2009 11:53 pm

aoe != aos Razz hes talking about this:

Betrayer_kharn wrote:on paper it seems bad but as i have told you which you obviously paid no heed to i have played and aos that had a very similar skill except they did more damage took less and it had a range of 1.2k i beleive and it still wasnt that bad and i like how u neglect to mention they take 200% more damage so 1-2 aoe's has now cleared your "op" army

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And unto the masses, He doth spoke:
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And the Stuff was good.

Heroes:
Commander Farsight (colab - implemented) - Ku'gaath Plaguefather(incomplete) - Ilyana Arienal(incomplete) - Harlequin Shadowseer(incomplete) - Modular Tau Battlesuit(sandbox)
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Post by Fromundaman on Tue Sep 29, 2009 12:32 am

You said you played an AoS with a similar skill, I am now asking once again, which AoS was this?
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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Tue Sep 29, 2009 9:26 am

its called bleach blade battlers and its the 8th espada it not hosted all to frequently anymore

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Post by Fromundaman on Tue Sep 29, 2009 10:43 am

Okay, ty. Is there a site I can find it on, or should I just hope someone eventually hosts it?
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Post by Grass Hopper on Tue Sep 29, 2009 12:01 pm


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And unto the masses, He doth spoke:
"Behold The Stuff! It Is Good!"
And the Stuff was good.

Heroes:
Commander Farsight (colab - implemented) - Ku'gaath Plaguefather(incomplete) - Ilyana Arienal(incomplete) - Harlequin Shadowseer(incomplete) - Modular Tau Battlesuit(sandbox)
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Post by Fromundaman on Tue Sep 29, 2009 2:58 pm

Thanks.

I only played this like 20 min in single player to quickly see who has the skill (don't have much time to host it atm), and my reactions are as follows:

-Indeed, in that game, it doesn't seem too OPed, at least in single player, though it does push like crazy. That being said, you have to keep in mind that Bleach only has 4 creeps to a spawn, whereas we have 5 main ones, + 1 war machine, + 2 more per outpost, + potentially 9+ from hireables (Though granted, that's not a consistent spawn, so I won't count it anymore. Just wanted to mention it.).
-Also, when creeps hit outposts in early game (Before heroes can adequately push), the defenders usually swell in size due to 2 or sometimes even 3 creep spawns joining during the time it takes to fight the creeps back. That makes a lot of illusions, and potentially makes this guy the best early-game pusher.
-I realize you made changes to the skill (Not 1k range, takes a little more damage, deals a lot more, and doesn't have a 5 sec CD... I hope...), but you also have to keep in mind that this skill was, in Bleach, part of an ultimate, and not a basic skill.

This is all without heroes or hireables thrown into the mix, each which would increase the strength of this skill considerably. (And getting 4 heroes in 1 place isn't that hard. In our game, we consistently had 3-4 heroes in one place. After all, that amount is an average gank, or an average defense vs lane push (2 on each side).)
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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Tue Sep 29, 2009 3:03 pm

well then in 2.1 they changed it because it used to be a normal skill but even so i do recall them putting in the ult also keep in mind his ult has a fairly low cd and a fairly long duration and the cd ticks away while u are in the form so theres very little downtime between not being able to cast and no 5 secs is way to low i was htinking maybe 30-30+ sec cd with a med-high mana cost and as i stated its ALOT smaller AoE then wht iti s in that map so its does considerably even less because in multiplayer in that map the same can happen without the hireables but a fairly large mass of creep can accumulate and with the range it has in there its fairly easy tol catch them all plus any heroes in range also theres is instant with a large aoe mine requires a cast and u have to pick your spot so stuff can move from when you pick your spot to when it takes effect (stuff might move out of the aoe at the last min) so if their instant, larger AoE, faster cast tiem skill wasnt op i really doubt my cast time, small AoE, medium cd skill will be as op as u have previosuly thought it would be

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Post by Fromundaman on Wed Sep 30, 2009 5:48 pm

Okay, so I finally played the Bleach game in a 3v3. Wow... that skill allowed me to push like crazy, and was effective for hero-killing (The latter, however, more due to the other effects of the ult, or them being stupid and allowing me to create enough clones of them to encircle them, as there are too few creeps in that game to do it otherwise.). Sadly, like you say, it's not even OPed, because, as everyone kept saying, that game is VERY unbalanced. A bad one to use as an example IMO Razz

Also, the large creep spawns in Bleach were almost the size of a normal one in this...

I still think it's OP, but whatever. At worst we can always playtest and modify I guess.



Oh, and according to the people who were playing/hosting Bleach, who def. didn't appear to be noobs (at least not 3 of them), that was never a basic skill. *shrug*
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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Wed Sep 30, 2009 11:01 pm

mehh odesnt really matter :-P i already said we could play test and actually u can have a game of that and it not be imba but it was more then likely ap so the "non noobs" could pick their op little chars and haev a good time its what frequently occurs. even so whether im right or worng on that asepct dont really matter but the fact that a clearly superior skill to mine wasnt even that op so i have a feeling this skill will perform just fine

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Post by Fromundaman on Thu Oct 01, 2009 12:04 pm

Oh, one more question about this skill (I swear it's the last one... I think...):

Does it target both allies and enemies (What I understood it did, but could very well be wrong), does it do like Bleach and only target enemies, or would it only target allies (Which, thinking about it, is probably the most logical.)?
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Post by Betrayer_kharn on Thu Oct 01, 2009 4:22 pm

either or whtever people feel it would work best

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