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[Adeptus Custodes Terminator] Truelais the Vigilant

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Post by 13loodRaven on Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:33 pm

Would like some feedback on the new hero, and storyline xD

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Post by Glycine on Thu Jan 20, 2011 1:22 pm

Errr. Besides the fact his storyline is wildly implausible and a Custodes hasn't been seen off Terra for millenia now, it's not too bad. Besides the imba. numbers, but that's usual.

What kind of hero do you want him to be?

PS: By the way, your hero can have health in excess of 3.5k. Just thought you'd like to know. ^^;
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Post by ZebioLizard on Thu Jan 20, 2011 1:38 pm

Why the hell are people fucking so many heroes? There's so many god damned uncreated hero's so far in the books, storylines, and various other immeneties. WHY THE FUCK ARE YOU PEOPLE CREATING THESE

Stop it..Just stop
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Post by Glycine on Thu Jan 20, 2011 2:27 pm

In an ideal world, I could ask people to pick from heroes in the literature, but it's not like everyone has the codices. I wish people would look at my lists in the black library, but no one does. I try to give a list of probable heroes, but there's not a lot I can do to force people to stop making up heroes with no background or basis in the fluff. I can, however, shout at you all to go to the tau forum in heroes and look at the list of tau heroes who should go into the game eventually. Only 12 main heroes from each faction will go into the map, with ~2 taverns for overflow and imagination
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Post by 13loodRaven on Fri Jan 21, 2011 5:55 am

Zebio.. It is why its still in bloody inactive hero suggestions... I could turn this hero into Constantin Valdor, (The commander of the custodes during the great crusade) but he isn't a Terminator. Feel free to recomment once you find fluff and background knowledge on a Custodes Terminator.

And Gly, He is a Terminator Razz anything apart from 'excessive tank' isn't good enough. xD The numbers can be toned down as numbers can, and I'm gearing this hero to be a teamfight-distruption type, as well as the anti-tank tank.

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Post by DeusMechanicus on Fri Jan 21, 2011 6:54 am

I already made a Valdor Razz

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Post by Glycine on Fri Jan 21, 2011 9:40 am

One, Valdor hasn't been seen for 10 millenia. Two, Custodes are to Space Marines as Space Marines are to regular humans and all Custodes do is guard the Emperor's throne room. They are a pre-heresy force predominantly, because that's the only time they could go anywhere and beat the crap out of anything.

If you can find *two* pieces of evidence that a single Custodes has been seen in the 41th century, then your story becomes plausible. And ergh, Custodes aren't made from Space Marines. They are not clones. Custodes were genetically different individuals enhanced by the power of science and the process used to make them is older and different than the process to make a Space Marine.

I want to inspire people to be creative, but not to work outside the boundaries of common sense and the timeline that we have. If a character is in the game, it had to have at least existed in the past millennium, unless it's like a Dreadnought or been stuck in the Warp for a long time.

If you rewrote his fluff, I could actually see how a Custodes in the 31th century could get trapped in time and emerge in the 41th century. And prove to me how having 2 pieces of the Emperor's armor is any different from having 1, as in normal Terminator Armor?

That said, 500% attack speed and 522 movement speed is impossible on a terminator. Utterly. Unless he has 4 arms and legs, his armor prevents him from moving that fast. If you're going to build him like a tank, he needs to act like one, not move frenetically.

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Post by DeusMechanicus on Fri Jan 21, 2011 9:42 am

Well, not M41. But ...
Age of Apostasy, M36. Razz
The Custodes emerged from the Imperial Palace and laid down the law to the Adepta Sororitas.

And that brings us back to the argument "Where do new Custodes come from?", which we've had in the Valdor thread, I believe. The Custodians were each genetically engineered by the Emperor himself, so how are they sustaining their numbers, when the Emperor is on the Golden Throne? They use the Emperor's DNA, and the Emperor himself doesn't age (at least not physically), so it's not that much of a stretch to believe the Custodians are his deathless guardians. About him having pieces of the Emperor's armor ... that's just blasphemous. The Emperor's armor was melted down after his fight on Horus' flagship and is now carried (in the form of shards) in the crux terminatus of Terminator Captains from all Space Marine chapters, in recognition of the Imperial Fist Terminator squad that came to aid him during his fight with Horus - sacrificing themselves to give the Emperor more time to deal with having to kill his son.

So, as a Terminator, he would have a crux terminatus, and a shard of the Emperor's armor, but not a full piece, let alone two. If they even did still exist, they'd be some of the most holy and guarded relics of the Imperium. Even the shards in armor of the Terminator Captains are never left on the battlefield, the Space Marines won't retreat until they've recovered the armor.

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Post by 13loodRaven on Fri Jan 21, 2011 11:40 am

Twas fluff just to fill in the spaces, I wasn't actually serious about it Razz. Besides

The first of the Custodes, the Legio Custodes, were the first ever altered warriors of the imperium, created by the Emperor himself, I think it was for the unification wars on Terra, I'm not sure...

But anyway, as gly said, (at least pointed towards) that the Custodes are from a totally different gene-seed than space marines. They are tougher, bigger, and smarter than any of the Astartes. Hence why they presently guard the golden throne. They are the most capable, versatile warriors the Imperium has. There is most probably a reserve of Adeptus Custodes gene-seed known by, and only accessable by the Emperor himself. (Hence why one would probably never leave the throne room.) Yeah, sure. I know that Termi-capts would be salvaged no matter the cost. I dont dissagree. Its the same as the Dreadnoughts. But dreads are far more valuable tbh.

And I mean pff, seriously. If we can have Greater Daemons, Chaos Champions, Brother-Captains, and Phoenix Lord's fighting the same battle, we sure as hell can have a Custodes, right?


Anyway, back to the hero.

Gly, do you think that maybe he should deal the damage he would during that three second timeframe, lets say 400. Would you prefer that damage in one snap second? Just bang. I get your point about a Terminator should be a lumbering heap of ceramite, capable of dealing heavy blows, but, a Terminator can indeed move fast, as long as he isn't restricted by assault cannons and such, which in this case, he isn't. Realistically, in game space, we have totally random effects. I dont even need to point them out, we all know that they're there.

Sure the numbers need to be changed T.T the fluff at the moment is irrelevent, suggestions on numbers are needed.

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Post by 13loodRaven on Fri Jan 21, 2011 11:46 am

Glycine said:

They are a pre-heresy force predominantly, because that's the only time they could go anywhere and beat the crap out of anything.

Not so. Custodes weaponry and armour is superior to gear supplied to Space Marines in the 41st Millenium, powerfull, ancient, ornate. There is no way in hell any Techpriest would allow the Emperor to be guarded by outdated warriors. Besides, even if their gear was outdated, they could still beat the living shit out of anything. They have had countless generations to hone thier talents, would almost know as much about war as a Dreadnought, possibly even more, and they can do things no ordinary Astarte could do. Such as assassination.

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Post by Glycine on Fri Jan 21, 2011 1:18 pm

I would dispute that Custodes are deathless, because think of the repercussions of that trait. You could make an army that never ages, never falters in battle capacity, and is the best of the best of the best. Why do you need normal Space Marines if you can make Custodes? If you want to crush something utterly, why not get a squad of Custodes?

The last time the Custodes took part in an actual battle was the Siege of Terra, and even at the end of the Age of Apostasy, their role was more of an advising one. I want *solid, readable* evidence that a Custodian has appeared on the battlefields of the 41th millenium. I don't care if they're deathless, or super saiyans, or demigods.

If they are as good as you say they are, then where are they? If they're so amazing, the High Lords of Terra should enlist them in special forces. If they're so capable and versatile, why are they ALL stuck guarding the Golden Throne? Is it that there are constant battles on Terra that necessitates the use of the Custodes? (trick question Razz)

I just want to see one reference from games-workshop or any source (Hell, even the novels) that shows evidence of Custodes in the 41th millennium and then I'll be happy to go along with it. But I have yet to see evidence like that.

If you want me to judge your character on the basis of his background and how plausible his events are, they aren't. xD

I question lifespan, how he managed to kill a whole ship of people, how he resisted the warp within the Eye of Terror, how he managed to make his way off the planet in the Eye of Terror, why wasn't he checked for corruption, whether or not he's fully machine, how the Inquisition views him, and questions ad infinitum.
Even if you're in the Eye of Terror, where time seemingly does not make sense, it is not possible for one Custodes to kill a planet full of Daemons, Heretics, or worse and somehow hijack a ship and find his way back.

To put it in perspective、Primarchs have gone into the Eye of Terror to beat the crap out of Chaos and no one has ever heard anything about them. Are you suggesting that a Custodes can do what a Primarch cannot?
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Post by 13loodRaven on Fri Jan 21, 2011 2:48 pm

As far as I know, there are only 10300 Adeptus Custodes. 10'000 guard the palace of Terra (from both threats foreign and local, for some select Custodes take part in the politics of Terra Razz) and the last 300 are behind the gate of Eternity, which is also guarded by two imperial titans and some of the 10'000 Custodes. Those inside are personal guardians to the Emperor. Oh and the General-Captain of the Custodes is, well, a High Lord of Terra, in an indirect way.

Remembering that Custodes are from a very unique gene-seed. They take part in singular missions (alike the one Truelais went on?) or, rarely, they create small groups in order to achieve what needed achieving, so they're in part, already special forces. One would not simply throw his greatest weapon into the face of the enemy. Sure it would get the job done, but for how long? Each couple of wars, Custodes would die. Think of them as the true Emperors children. (apart from the Primarchs) tbh, their gene-seed is probably very limited, and as such, must be treaded like a limited, but incredebly valuable resource.


But w/e back to the Hero storyline:

Lets just say he was on a pleasure cruise, to spit in the face of chaos. He travels to a Chaos World, far enough from the Eye to survive, but not far enough as to resist its corruption. He jumps of his ship, slaughters a whole lot of crap, bloodthirst sated, he comes back to his ship, only to find it sabotaged by Lesser Horrors.
He gets pissed, stomps on them all, and jacks a small chaos vessel, killing everyone inside. Ok, even if the crew exceeded 20 people, but no more than 40, was on the vessel, there is no way in hell anything would survive the wrath of a terminator (even a run off the mill one) in such tight quatres. *Storm shield* *Face smashing* *The end*

After this little escapade, lets say Truelais was a little pooped, and couldn't be screwed flying the craft, he just used the wonderous 20M invention of autopilot. I bet it smelled in there.


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Post by 13loodRaven on Fri Jan 21, 2011 3:22 pm

And back to one of my other posts... We have all these different w40k characters in the mix of a seemingly random skirmish, why cant we have Adeptus Custodes? Lets just say the planet where 40kaos is being fought is of great interest to all races and thier leaders. Perhaps Truelais was sent by the General-Captain or the Emperor to secure a valuable Relic... Lmao not that same old story ><

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Post by DeusMechanicus on Fri Jan 21, 2011 7:11 pm

Glycine wrote:I would dispute that Custodes are deathless, because think of the repercussions of that trait. You could make an army that never ages, never falters in battle capacity, and is the best of the best of the best. Why do you need normal Space Marines if you can make Custodes? If you want to crush something utterly, why not get a squad of Custodes?

Because Custodes are hand crafted, Space Marines are made on an assembly line. Razz

Before the Siege of Holy Terra, the Custodes did fight as part of the Great Crusade, only the 300 Companions were kept near the Emperor as his bodyguards. And they did shitkick people on the battlefield (see "Prospero Burns"). Also, the High Lords of Terra can't tell the Custodians to do jack or shit, because one of the Custodians always sits on the council. Besides, the Space Marines can handle the day-to-day threats, the Custodians are guarding the Emperor. If he is killed (or finished off, whatever), the Imperium falls apart in a matter of days.


Last edited by DeusMechanicus on Fri Jan 21, 2011 7:15 pm; edited 2 times in total

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Post by ZebioLizard on Fri Jan 21, 2011 7:13 pm

Mine is because we have such lack of information that would justify any sort of numbers/weapons/or characters. Not sure why gly is stuck on them being apart of the battle for just..not being in the 41st millennium though
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Post by 13loodRaven on Sat Jan 22, 2011 2:05 am

The Custodes that sits on the Council with the High Lords of Terra is the General-Captain of the Adeptus Custodes Razz

And if the Emperor was to fall, that psychic beacon of his that allows Imperial Vessels to travel through the warp at breakneck speed, would cease to exist. Also, the Emperor is the only psychic being more powerfull than the Chaos Gods.. So if he dies, humanity is pretty much screwed. Such a task of defending the Emperor would be done only by the best; the Adeptus Custodes.


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Post by Glycine on Sat Jan 22, 2011 3:23 am

Lol, Zebio, that's also a concern of mine. If there's no info about them in the recent period, how can you estimate what they can do?

Blood, you don't have to argue about them being the best. I know Custodes are quite good. I don't really care about their duties that keep them stuck on Terra, because I know this already.

Though Custodes also got their asses shitkicked during the HH (See the First Heretic). Just because they're really damn good warriors doesn't make them invincible or deathless or whatever other label you want to put on them without substantiation. Terminators get screwed by Genestealers on Space Hulks all the time. Yes, Terminator Armor is also very sturdy, but it's not invincible either.

If guarding the Emperor's corpse (Astronomican) is so important, under what circumstances could a Custodes leave the palace? Is this written somewhere? Have Custodes done it in the past? Is there a named Custodes that is still alive, with reasonable proof? (Valdor doesn't count, Deus ^^)

I'm being hard on you because I'd really like to have people work with named characters first, where there's an actual background and the skills have been semi-worked out. (Forgive me? xD I'm tired of you two giving Custodes fellatio. I *know* their fluff. So what if they're good? All things can die in war, whether they be Daemons or Primarchs (Except Necrons >>) )

Given your storyline, I find it contradictory. So all Custodes spend their time guarding the Emperor. Why is it that Truelais *isn't*? What gives him the freedom to walk around and find himself on a random battlefield? Your character is plausible, but I'm not going to write his story for you. You have to think of a way in which a Custodes could LOGICALLY appear on a battlefield in the 41th century, if they're not all stuck guarding the Emperor.

If you can figure out the logic behind your character, I'll be happy to look at skills and all that jazz. But any one thing can go terribly wrong in your scenario, which will more often than not end up killing Truelais in the Eye of Terror.

Hint: Time Dilation and Warp Travel are good places to start :]
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Post by DeusMechanicus on Sat Jan 22, 2011 3:35 am

Custodes leave the Imperial Palace during times that the Emperor (not the Imperium, the Emperor) is in danger (see Age of Apostasy). Who says the map doesn't take place on Holy Terra? The Ork Waaagh! could be closing in on the Imperial Palace. Razz

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Post by Glycine on Sat Jan 22, 2011 4:07 am

If this map is on Terra, then the Imperium is boned. If all the other races are present, why isn't everyone trying to kill the Emperor instead of the Orks? xD

Tau/Eldar: *shrug*
Dark Eldar/Necrons: We kill everything, even if it has no life.
Tyranids: Oh, astronomican. Let's nom nom nom our way to it.
Orks: WAAAAAGH >>

This essentially means that situation isn't exactly plausible, unless the giant pit lord at top right is the Emperor. >> *shudders*
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Post by 13loodRaven on Sat Jan 22, 2011 9:11 am

Yep. Custodes do indeed leave the palace, if they are required to do the Emperors will, or their General-Captain. They never leave the Palace in excessive numbers though. Seeing how the Palace spans continents and there are only 10'000 Custodes to guard it.

Besides, I never said anything about the Custodes being deathless. A Terminator itself is a bugger to kill, but a Custodes Terminator harder still. But in the end, everything bleeds the same.

Gly, you said you knew the fluff right? There are only 300 Custode 'Companions' that guard the Emperors physically incapable form. Then the hugeass door to the throneroom, which is made of adamantium and ceramite. No doubt its bloody thick too. Then the Gate of Eternity is then guarded by two Imperial Titans, and then the 10'000 Custodes that guard the door, and the palace surrounding it. The chain goes on through planetary defense and all the other forces that the Imperium has to offer. That being said I think the Emperor is quite safe gly Razz

With that out of the way, there are important tasks that require the special attention of a Custodes, or rarely, a small group of Custodes. I've said this before. That itself gives a Custodes freedom to be outside of the Palace, or, most improbably, but possibly, on a completely different planet.

Tbh, anything will die, or cease to work, in war. Including Necrons. Sure the metal is living, but some fellow could just gather up all the inactive necrons, and smelt the metal up, and create some new alloy. xD

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Post by DeusMechanicus on Sat Jan 22, 2011 9:37 am

Gly ... Really? And a Bloodthirster fighting next to a Grey Knight is plausible? Or Cato and Khârn? Or Lelith and Eldrad? Or Asurmen and Necron Lord? Or Carnifex and Lemartes? I can go on and on and on.. Speaking of Khârn, anyone know he had a kill counter installed in his helmet's HUD during the Great Crusade? xD

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Post by cellrawr on Sat Jan 22, 2011 9:52 am

It has got to be in the millions+ by now. Oh, and yes.

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Post by 13loodRaven on Sat Jan 22, 2011 9:53 am

What a nifty gadget.

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Post by Glycine on Sat Jan 22, 2011 12:56 pm

Feth. >> Had a nice long post that disappeared.

Quick version:

I wonder if Kharn's counter had sound effects when he went on a killing streak.

Deus, all the characters you mentioned are named, have a plot, and have stats and other details with them. The necessary evil of an All Pick mode can put a Paladin and a Death Knight together, so unless you want to make everything more rigid so that the Imperial can't really fight with anyone except the Eldar, etc, etc... There is nothing I or Grass or anyone can do about the hypocrisy of a BT and a Grey Knight fighting together.

For one, there are two Custodes (Valdor and this guy). Why should a single faction, the rarest faction of any in the whole universe, get two heroes when frankly, their only role is to sit around and guard the Emperor? Important, yes, but not important to merit their emergence into the universe lately in a named form.

Both of you, Deus and Blood, have to invent wildly preposterous scenarios just for the Custodes to see battle (Valdor doesn't live that long, unless he's in a Dreadnought, and war will never come to Holy Terra for the immediate future).

That said...

I'm not opposed to a Custodes if it's done right the first time. I don't even want to have to touch it once it's in the game, because there's enough work to go around for the map. Don't just throw in skills for a tank, because then you're doing what Deus did with Void Dragon (To be fair, your interpretation needs work. Corpse bolt? Really? He's a god of technology, not the deathbringer. Silences and malfunctions should be his calling card).

What's special about a Custodes? What do they have that other people don't? Why is he a terminator? Does he have special benefits in his armor or special abilities as a result of being a Custodes?

Anyone can have a power hammer, Terminators are damn slow and would much rather use a teleporter than a charge, he has no justification to do %max health on attack, and if he is always wearing the Terminator armor, why doesn't he get strength automatically instead of through the ult?

If you can find the background or make a suitable background for your Custodes, then I won't utter a word more. Going in the Eye of Terror, beating shit up, and managing to survive out, however, is NOT a realistic background.

Side note: Also, it'll take 40 seconds for him to go from 310 MS to 445 MS. Not an efficient skill. >>
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Post by DeusMechanicus on Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:08 pm

Still haven't given me a reason why Valdor couldn't be alive.

While I've listed off several reason why he could.

And, if I remember correctly, Etheric Bolt was Grass' idea.

Children, Necrodermis and Will match the fluff.

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